Tuesday, 19 August 2008

Contradictions in the bible

Dan Barker once asked an xian what they would count as a contradiction in the bible. They said that it would be something like one gopel saying jebus was cricified on a tuesday and the other saying he was crucified on a Friday. Now when xians want concrete examples of contradicions like that how can us atheists possible argue our case? Xians seem to think that if they can find a way to reconcile the contradictions we produce it somehow makes them go away but why? Simply saying one was using metaphoriacal language, or that they are refering to different times or just because one gospel doesn't mention it doesn't mean it contradicts with the gospel that does is a complete cop out.

Take the two genealogies, now they clearly contradict each other and yet xians will claim that one is for marys side of the family and the other is for josephs. As if we are going to accept that.

7 comments:

Anonymous said...

Mike said:Now when xians want concrete examples of contradicions like that how can us atheists possible argue our case?

Good morning Mike.

What do you mean by, "how can us atheists possible argue our case?" ?

That sentence alone makes it sound as if you are not being honest.

Would you rather argue your case, or find the truth?

Xians seem to think that if they can find a way to reconcile the contradictions we produce it somehow makes them go away

Actually, the very first time someone confronted me about contradictions, i was scared... scared that maybe they were right.
But as i looked at what they were presenting it was obvious that they were not contradictions, but misunderstanding.

And quite often, the atheist has not actually looked at it himself, but rather, found it from some list that some other atheist has posted on the web somewhere.

So, Mike, let me ask you... If you present a difficulty in the Bible, will you be honest enough to accept being wrong, IF indeed, you are wrong?


Simply saying one was using metaphoriacal language, or that they are refering to different times or just because one gospel doesn't mention it doesn't mean it contradicts with the gospel that does is a complete cop out.


I agree with you...

Simply saying it IS a cop out. However, are you sure that some answers are not legitimate metaphores? or cultural understandings? or required to be exactly repeated in all the Gospels?

How sure are you that the Christian is "copping out", rather than giving a good, sound answer?

Take the two genealogies, now they clearly contradict each other and yet xians will claim that one is for marys side of the family and the other is for josephs. As if we are going to accept that.


Mike....

Think about what you've just said, and rephrase it.

I'll help you by pointing out your misunderstanding.

Are your ancestors on your mothers side the same people as the ancestors on your dad's side?

Because they are different does not mean that they contradict each other.

Most people do not have the same list on dad's side as on mum's. Occasionally there might be one from both sides... without it being creepy...
My mom's cousin married my dad's brother.... that wedding is where my mom and dad met.


OK Mike... your turn. Show us that you can sometimes look at things honestly.

God Bless,
johnny

Anonymous said...

Hi again Mike.

While i was getting ready for work, another thing occurred to me.


The Law of Non-contradiction states that A can not be both B and non-B at the same time and in the same way.

If i were to tell you that my dad died before i was born 43 years ago. And then tell you that my dad was hit by a truck while on his bicycle a month ago, and is currently in a coma in the hospital.... the two statements would come into question as a possible contradiction.

But..

If i were to explain that my biological dad drown while fishing 43 years ago, a few months before i was born. And that my mom re-married and her second husband adopted me when i was 4 years old, you would be able to see that it is not a contradiction that my dad is both dead and non-dead, because it is not at the same time nor in the same way.

The above account is true.

And i hope you can now understand that difficulties in the Bible can, quite possibly be non-contradictions if enough information is considered.


well, i'm off to work.

Have a good day Mike.

johnny

The Wigan Crossfitter said...

Hello fellow atheist.

I was fortunate enough to find your blog today and I sir, am impressed.

I find it rather tiresome arguing with delusional people, and am glad that you have decided to take on this Sisyphean task

MrFreeThinker said...

Hey The Wigan Crossfitter
I'm glad you found Mike's blog. His blog is full of arguments that are great- like the arguement from honey and the argument from phallic inadequacy. He even had a theory that Jesus' tomb was empty because he was eaten by worms after the disciples returned from Mount Veviscus and they copied their story of Jesus from Dionysus after seeing how badly his body had been eaten.
Mike's blog stretches the limits of reason and the imagination

Sir-Think-A-Lot said...

I do hope taht above post was sarcasm...

Anywho on to Mike Trite:

Most Biblical 'contradictions' I'v seen are not only possible to reconcile, but are so riduculously easy to reconcile that it amazes me anybody thought they were contradictory.

There are however some that are not so easy, but even these have plausible reconcilations. Yes simply saying one is metaphorical or referes to a different time doesnt make it true. But by the same token simply screaming "COP OUT!" at the top of your lungs doesnt make these explanations false either.

On Jesus's genologies. Thats actually one of the latter types of contradictions. Just FYI I think that one being Mary's and one being Joseph's lineage is a plausible explanation. But I think that there is a better one: namely that one is his biological line and the other his legal line(that is who inhereted the rights of their father/ancestors). The two lines differ because of Jewish inheretence lines and politics.

Anonymous said...

Where does it say that Jesus was crucified on a Tuesday?

Anonymous said...

No, that was not Mike's claim. His claim is that Dan Barker asked a/some Christian/Christians what he/we would count as a contradiction in the Bible.

The Christian(s) response was one where a Gospel said a particular day, and a different Gospel said a different specific day i.e Monday and Saturday or as Mike's example, Tuesday and Friday.


johnny